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The Marbles Dropping Mystery has plagued many
HDB flats residents for as long as anyone can remember. Ask
anyone on the streets, chances are that 1 out of 5 would tell
you that they do recall hearing those marbles dropping on the
floor from the units above them, most of the time during
unearthly hours, and sometimes, during the day as well. Often
the marbles dropping sounds could be attributed to real
playful children playing with marbles.
But the concept of playing with marbles doesn't tie in well
with modern times when marbles playing is already considered a
traditional game. Besides, marbles are considered small
objects and could be easily swallowed by young kids playing
with them.
So, could the sounds of marbles dropping on the floor be
due to playful children, or are they something else
altogether?
Though the Marble Dropping Phenomena was considered
widespread, no one really dared to talk or even admit publicly
that he or she had such a problem. Until 1 day.. someone wrote
in to the Straits Times Forum...... |
Children playing with
marbles
Playing with marbles in older
days |
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The
1st Article in STRAITS TIMES - A letter to ST Forum |
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The date, June 6, 2005.
A Singaporean by the name of
Joseph Wong wrote in to the Forum page of the Straits Times,
complaining of marble dropping sounds coming from the above
floor unit occurring in the early hours of the morning.
This is what Mr Joseph wrote:
I can hear marbles... or am I losing
mine?
IN THE 15 years I lived in my three-room HDB flat in
Lorong Ah Soo, my family had to endure what sounded like
marbles being dropped on the floor of the unit above mine.
Strangely, this seemed to take place only at night, at times
in the wee hours of the morning. Never one for confrontation,
I did not speak to the occupants upstairs, and we lived with
it.
We moved to Punggol 21 five years ago, and the sound of
marbles dropping in the wee hours of the morning seems to have
followed us. I once trotted upstairs to see what sort of
neighbours I have and the occupants were an elderly woman, her
weak elderly husband and their domestic help. It is unlikely
they played with marbles, and certainly not in the wee hours
of the morning.
From conversations with friends, I was astounded to
learn that this sound of dropping marbles is a widespread
phenomenon in Singapore. It seems it happens only in HDB
flats. One of my friends even suggested it may be the way HDB
flats are built.
As a non-believer in the supernatural, I am eager to
understand this mystery that is fast becoming an urban legend.
I may have a legitimate reason to ask the HDB to explain it,
since it seems to inflict only flats built by it.
Joseph Wong Yong Lye
Charles Goh: So it would seemed that Mr Joseph
has wrote a very interesting case. He had been
experiencing marble dropping sounds in Lor Ah Soo for 15
years, and even when h has moved to Ponggul 21 5 years ago,
the marble dropping sounds followed him there. More
interesting was the fact that Mr Joseph had went up to the
upper floor and found no children there, just elderly
folks.
He has asked the HDB to give an explanation for the
strange noise. Would HDB reply? It would certainly be
interesting to hear what they had to say.
2 days later, Mr Joseph got a very interesting reply not
from the HDB, but from another HDB dweller, a Mdm
Sharini. |
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The 2nd Article in STRAITS
TIMES - The 1st Forum Exchange
The date, June 8, 2005.
'Marbles' on the brain?
Take them in the right spirit
I AM amused at the prospect of a reply from the HDB to
the query by Mr Joseph Wong Yong Lye about the sound of
marbles on the floor of the unit above his in the wee hours of
the morning ('I can hear marbles... or am I losing mine?'; ST,
June 6).
Having lived in four different HDB flats from my
childhood to my present nesting ground, the familiar sound of
marbles has become integral to my idea of HDB living. Amid all
sorts of sounds, pleasant or otherwise, my reaction has
progressed from being spooked, irritated and curious to mostly
nonchalant now.
Until a better explanation can be found, my only
explanation of the sound of marbles on the floor of the unit
above mine is that certain jinn, or creatures from the other
dimension, are fond of making such noises in the wee hours of
the morning. Especially after all the neighbours above my unit
have moved out! This was the case when my family was among the
last few left behind in our block which was affected by the
Selective En-bloc Redevelopment Scheme.
In the present situation, I unashamedly advocate that we
stretch our neighbourly tolerance a little further, possibly
to accommodate the ever-crowding supernatural world as we
would our own fast-expanding one. I am, however, against any
get-to-know-your-jinn-neighbour campaign!
If it is any relief to Mr Wong, I no longer hear the
'marbles', though my eldest son has described them exactly as
Mr Wong did.
Sharini Shamsuddin
(Mdm)
Charles Goh: So Mdm Sharini declared here that
marble dropping sounds is very common & was an integral
part of her life. She then advised Mr Joseph to take the
marble sounds' in the right spirit!"
So should we embrace the supernatural world as she hoped
Mr Joseph would do. So what IS HDB reply to this too?
But alas, HDB was spared from answering directly to both
Mr Jpseph & Mdm Sharini through the intervention of a Ms
Sujatha, who apparently had a very normal reason for the noise
upstairs. |
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The 3rd Article in STRAITS
TIMES - The Second Forum Exchange
The date, June 12, 2005.
No way to end the
noise
I REFER to Mr Joseph Wong Yong Lye's letter, 'I can hear
marbles... or am I losing mine?' (ST, June 6).
Over the past couple of months, I have been tormented by
noisy children above me stomping their feet, running, throwing
toys on the floor, dragging furniture, dropping heavy objects
and so on.
I have asked the HDB on several occasions to advise the
tenants on the upper floor to minimise the noise, but it just
got worse.
HDB then passed the issue to the police for intervention
and mediation, but that also ended in a deadlock, this time
worse than before.
From the police, it went on to the Central Mediation
Centre under the Ministry of Law. The matter is still
pending.
I would like the HDB to explain how far its powers
extend in situations like this.
I was told there is no clause in the Housing Act which
gives it the power to penalise inconsiderate tenants.
It acts only when premises are being used as a gaming
house, prostitutes' den or for other money-making activities.
Eviction is enforced only on such grounds.
Can HDB amend the Act to give it the authority to
enforce some kind of penalty and minimise the rigmarole of
going through a gruelling series of investigations and
fruitless meetings?
Sujatha Ommini Vidyadharan (Ms)
Charles Goh: Ms Sujatha noisy upstairs neighbor
was real, with the HDB, Police & a Mediation Centre called
in to boot. The issue of ghostly HDB tenants playing with
marbles has effectiveky been 'replaced' by a real noisy
neighbor problem.
Now, on safe grounds again, or maybe it was just sheer
coincidence, the HDB, AND THE POLICE, now replied. Not to the
1st two forum writers though, but to Ms Sujatha
only. |
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The 4th Article in STRAITS
TIMES - The Government Replies
The date, June 18,
2005.
Noisy
neighbours? HDB
for mediation
I REFER to the letter, 'No way to end the noise' by Ms
Sujatha Ommini Vidyadharan (The Sunday Times, June
12).
When the HDB receives feedback on noise nuisance, its
officers will visit the affected parties. Where necessary, we
also interview other residents nearby to verify the
complaint.
We emphasise resolution through mediation. We encourage
the parties to exercise consideration by generating less noise
and also showing some degree of tolerance towards their
neighbours for a harmonious living environment. We do not take
sides in any neighbour disputes.
The police may intervene in cases of noisy neighbour
disputes. However, most noise nuisance cases are community and
neighbourliness issues that can be resolved amicably, if both
parties are willing to communicate.
In private disputes, owners have to take responsibility
to resolve such matters themselves. If this fails, the parties
can seek mediation at a community mediation centre. In extreme
cases, the aggrieved party may wish to consult his
solicitor.
In Ms Vidyadharan's case, the HDB advised her
upper-floor neighbour to avoid creating excessive noise,
especially at night. Her neighbour has assured us they will
minimise the noise created by their children. The police,
together with the local grassroots leaders, also intervened to
get both parties to talk. The matter has since been referred
to the Central Community Mediation Centre and we understand
both parties have met for mediation.
For feedback on noise nuisance, residents can contact
our branch office service line on 1800-2255432 during office
hours. Our HDB branch office will look into the feedback and
give necessary assistance where appropriate.
The police recognise that noise pollution at night is
likely to cause greater annoyance. As such, for noise
pollution complaints at night (typically between 10.30pm and
7am), police officers will attend the scene.
ASP Victor Keong Assistant Director, Media
Relations Public Affairs Department Police
Headquarters
Tay Boon Sun Senior Public Relations
Officer Corporate Development Department Housing and
Development Board
Charles Goh: Thus for both the HDB & Police,
they would be most happy to consider this case closed. Would
then Singaporean be depraved of this chance to explore this
mystery further?
Lucky for us, The Sleuthing Reporters from Straits Times
are not lazing around & they recognized an opportunity to
make news when they see one.
On June 12th, ST published an article regarding the
elusive marbles, having consulted HDB and Industry Experts on
this matter. Yours truly was 1 of them. |
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The 5th Article in STRAITS
TIMES - The Straits Times' Answer
The
date, June 12, 2005
Mystery of the falling
marbles
Structural engineers say noise
comes from plumbing or concrete floors while others give
different explanations
By Chua Kong Ho
HEAR that? Someone in the flat above is playing with
marbles. But it's 1.30am. No child would be up at this
witching hour.
The mystery deepens for bank executive
Joseph Wong, 47, because his upstairs neighbours are an
elderly couple. No youngster live in their five-room HDB flat.
(Our 1st Forum Exchange)
When The Sunday Times
interviewed the families living up to three floors above him,
all denied dropping marbles or any other objects on the floor
so late at night.
Also, the sound seemed to have
followed Mr Wong from Lorong Ah Soo to his new home in
Edgefield Plains in Punggol.
Wags, of course, would say
he has lost his marbles.
But his letter to The Straits
Times Forum Page last week, asking the HDB for answers, has
stirred out of the shadows many who have been similarly vexed,
if not puzzled.
It has also plunged Singaporeans into a
frenzy of fuzzy theories. The Straits Times received more than
a dozen letters, including one from Madam Sharini Shamsuddin,
who playfully suggested that spirits are at
work.
Internet forums are swelling with explanations
that make you want to throw up your hands in disbelief. One
that probably coaxed many laughs, both nervous and mocking, is
the suggestion that the HDB had placed marbles between floors
so that playful spirits would be so distracted playing with
them, residents will be left in peace.
If so, private
developers have been equally diabolical. Expatriate Julian
Cohen, 42, has been haunted by the same sounds at each of the
three private condominiums he moved into in the past 10 years.
He also heard them when he was working in Hong Kong.
He
said wryly: 'I guess Joseph can take consolation that the
marble-dropper doesn't just live above his HDB flat but drives
round to his second apartment above mine to continue his
marble-dropping activities after he has woken Joseph
up.'
Mr Wong's wife Geralda and six-year-old daughter
Amanda, however, are sound sleepers, deaf to the disturbing
noise. 'Always, the noise happens between 1.30am and 4am. It
spooked me initially but as the years go by, you get used to
it,' he said.
Postgraduate student Lim Leng Hiong, 28,
who lives in Holland Drive, suspects golf enthusiasts are
practising their putting at home.
In an experiment, he
found that glass marbles, ping pong balls and golf balls, when
dropped, produce different sounds. 'But it's hard to tell the
difference when heard on their own,' he noted.
The only
problem with his explanation, of course, is that HDB dwellers
have been hearing the sounds of marbles way before the recent
golf craze.
HDB would have you believe that every sound
has a reason. It said in a letter to The Straits Times: 'To
date, we have not received any feedback on the sound of
dropping marbles where there has not been any attributable
cause.'
What could be some of the attributable causes?
HDB spokesman Tay Boon Sun is not telling. But he gave the
assurance that the acoustic properties of flats do not differ
from other residential buildings.
More forthcoming are
structural engineers and the Founder of Asia Paranormal
Investigators, Mr Charles Goh. Their answers, however,
indicate that when things go bump in the night, the reasons
are rarely beyond the mundane.
Mr Goh, 37, said the
marble sounds can be traced to air-con pipes or old
refrigerators, while the sounds of furniture being dragged
across the ceiling, another common occurrence, could be due to
lift doors opening and closing.
Structural engineers
point to two probable causes: the plumbing and the concrete
walls and floors.
Mr Wong subscribes to the last
because that's where he hears the marble sounds in his
flat.
Mr Crispin Casimir, owner of CC Building
Surveyors, and Dr Tan Guan, a director at TY Lin SEA, will
have you focus on the concrete.
Concrete floors may
contract at night, giving off creaking sounds, Dr Tan
said.
Mr Casimir added: 'Sounds travel and are
distorted as they pass through concrete walls and
floors.'
Mr Shek Kam Chew, 68, a structural engineer
since 1966, is convinced it's in the plumbing.
'It's
definitely not supernatural but what is called 'water
hammer',' he said.
Water hammer occurs when water flow
is shut off suddenly like when the toilet is flushed. This
change in pressure rattles the piping and create
'clanging'sounds, which may sound like marbles dropping after
distortion through concrete walls, he said.
Still
sceptical? Why not stick with the obvious? Surveys have shown
that Singaporeans sleep late. So really, it's just children
playing with
marbles.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Three explanations
1 When water flow is shut off suddenly, the change in
pressure rattles the pipes, which may sound like marbles
dropping after distortion through walls.
2 Some
pre-fabricated floors used in HDB flats have an embedded
high-strength steel cable which can give off creaking sounds
when they contract.
3 It is really children playing
with
marbles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What the HDB says
'HDB flats are designed
based on prevailing building codes. Hence, the acoustic
properties for flats are no different from other residential
buildings. To date, we have not received any feedback on the
sound of dropping marbles where there has not been any
attributable cause. HDB Sengkang Branch Office, which manages
the flats at Punggol Town, has not received any feedback about
the sound of dropping marbles in the area.
In Mr Wong's
case, we have contacted him and offered HDB's help. We will be
checking with his neighbours over the next few days to see if
we can locate the source of the sounds Mr Wong mentioned.
Madam Shamsuddin mentioned that her eldest son described
hearing similar sounds as Mr Wong. If she would like us to
look into the matter too, she can contact our Toll-free Branch
Office Service Line: 1800-2255-432 to provide us with her
address.
In a high-rise, high-density living
environment, a certain degree of noise is inevitable. It would
also be in the interest of neighbourliness for residents to
ensure that the activities carried out within the flat do not
generate excessive noise and to exercise some degree of
tolerance towards their
neighbours.'
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What the readers say
'The pipes of some
air-con units make popping sounds. These sounds resemble
marbles dropping when they travel through the pipe embedded in
walls. Another possibility is that in some old fridges, the
compressor makes this noise which can be heard clearly only at
wee hours when it's quiet.' -- MR CHARLES GOH, Founder of
the Asia Paranormal Investigators
'I'm quite sure that
this 'urban legend' is due to a real social phenomenon: the
Singaporeans' love of mahjong.' -- MR CHRISTOPHER YEO JER
SIONG, Chuan Terrace
'Could the sound be attributed to
the expansion of a certain type of tiled floor in the much
cooler early hours of the morning?'
Charles Goh: Finally the marble dropping
phenomena reached its climax when the Straits Times published
an article citing the results of an investigation by a
paranormal group, SPI, on June 26th. ........ |
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The 6th Article in STRAITS
TIMES - The Answer?
The
date, June 26, 2005
Strange sounds due to
water in PVC pipes
Paranormal
investigators' society comes up with explanation for sound of
falling marbles with an experiment
By By Goh Wen Zhong
F YOU'RE still hearing the sound of falling marbles in
your flat, it could be your neighbour washing up at the
sink.
After a five-hour experiment on Wednesday, members of
the Singapore Paranormal Investigators (SPI), a society made
up of paranormal enthusiasts, have come up with what it thinks
is the real reason.
They say the sound comes from water trickling through
PVC pipes, which gets distorted through concrete before
emerging as the sound of falling marbles.
This phenomenon has been in the news lately.
It all started when The Straits Times Forum published a
letter by bank executive Joseph Wong, who kept hearing the
sound of falling marbles in his flat. A flurry of letters from
other people followed, all saying they had also heard the
sounds, and wanting to know the cause.
Some even suggested there might be a supernatural
explanation.
But in a Sunday Times report on June 12, building
experts said it might be caused by the rattling of water pipes
when there's a change in water pressure, the contraction of
high-strength steel cables embedded in pre-fabricated floors,
or children actually playing with marbles.
The SPI was not satisfied. It wanted to narrow down the
possible causes.
Said the society's treasurer, Mr Eugene Toh, 26, an
insurance agent: 'We want to allay the concerns of the public
with conclusive and reliable evidence to point out the
cause.'
The society's month-long investigations hit paydirt on
Wednesday when four of its members gathered at Mr Toh's home,
an HDB maisonette in Bedok.
On the upper floor of the two-storey house, they dropped
marbles big and small, flushed toilets, turned on taps and
recorded the sounds.
They also recorded the sounds from the floor
below.
They then compared the sound frequencies with a
recording they had made of falling marbles.
Bingo.
SPI president Kenny Fong, 36, an assistant professor at
the University of Macau, said: 'The frequency signatures of
sound flowing from the sink through water pipes and that of
falling marbles were almost identical.'
Asked about SPI's findings, Mr Shek Kam Chew, 68, who
has 39 years of experience as a structural engineer, agreed
that it was plausible.
For the SPI, which was registered as a society last
month, the investigations do not end here. Mr Fong and his
team want to do more tests to bolster their
claim.
Charles Goh: So, could the sounds of falling
marbles be due to water rushing down the sink? SPI thinks so
& their investigation augment that argument
But I beg to differ in my opinion. Because if that
would be true, then the marble dropping phenomena would have
been more widespread than it is now, with multiple 'sightings'
everyday.
Having lived in high rise apartments all my life,
working in the building & construction industry for the
past 16 years, and being an Investigators of sorts for the
last 5 years. I am sure that the answers lies very simply
before us.
No scientific equipment or 'ghost hunting' gadgets is
needed to unravel this mystery. Just plain common sense and
some rational analyzing. |
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The 7th Article
NOT in
STRAITS TIMES, but published here in API
The date, January 3, 2006
Marble Dropping is no
Mystery
There is no SINGLE answer to this marble dropping
mystery. Simple reason being the cases of marbles dropping
sounds being heard should be examined 1 at a
time.
No equipment is necessary. All it takes is critical
& rational analysis of each case.
There are many plausible explanations, and each incident
should be investigated based on its own merit.
Firstly we will need to realize that all kinds of piping
run within the floor slabs and walls of a high-rise
building. These include our sanitary or soil pipes (you
know... the ones which carries our waste.. erks!),
water pipes supplying our PUB drinking water, refrigeration
pipes from Chillers, water condensation pipes from our air
conditioning. All these pipes have the potential of causing
marble-like dropping sounds in our high-rise
flats.
Poorly maintained or serviced equipment too can use
marbles dropping sounds when they are turned on.
Therefore, the explanations would generally fall along
the following lines.
(1) There are really children playing with marbles. -
This is the simplest of explanation. Just go upstairs &
check it out. Marbles sounds by children playing usually sound
like many marbles are thrown onto the floor, and the sounds
are frequent and inconsistent.
(2) Water hammering in PUB water supply pipes
caused by prolonged period of no water activity in the water
pipes. This causes air volume/pressure to built up in the
pipe. When water is re-introduced into the piping system,
pockets of air bubbles are formed as the water rushes in to
replace the air. If you recall at times when you open the tap,
and sometimes the 1st few gush of water is intermittent with
air spurting out. Such gushes of water with air trapped within
its flow will cause the water hammering sounds, which may
travel through the concrete surfaces and appears like marbles
dropping sounds. This kind of marble sounds appears only
briefly and is seldom repeated for the rest of the
night.
(3) Soapy water bubbles bursting in sanitary pipes. This
usually occurs at night when the pipes are not so often used,
and there is a sudden release of soapy water flowing down the
pipes. This usually occurs when the higher floor units flushes
down sufficient quantity of soap water. A similar bubbly
situation would also occur when are already plenty of soapy
water at the base of the piping system due to many residents
bathing at the same time. Each sanitary pipe stack has
vents at the roof top to allow air to escape out. Thus the
agitation of the soapy solution will cause bubbles to form and
the resulting air pockets bursting will sound like "Pock!
Pock! Pock!" echoing in the pipes, sounding like marbles as
the bubbles 'break' on the surface of the water. Usually
marbles sounds of this sort will be only singular sound of 1
marble (means only sound like 1 marble dropping) is
heard.
(4) Aircon refrigeration pipes & old fridges piping
after a period of time, will start to accumulate particulates
and bubbles in its piping system. and all these
impurities will cause rattling and vibrations in the piping.
Such sounds can manifest itself as marble dropping noises.
That is why aircon serviceman would want to have 'Total
Flushing System of your aircon after a period of use. Such
sounds are faint, and often continuous. The sounds also appear
when the old aircon or compressor unit is turned
on.
(5) Aircon condensation pipes can also contribute to the
marble dropping phenomena. When air-conditioning units
operates, water condensation takes place, and are discharged
via a small water pipe that will terminate into a sanitary
pipe. Sometimes sediments or debris within the sanitary pipe
will cause more water to be stored at the pipe elbow. Thus the
water droplets that drip from the condensation pipe that is
not flushed with the drainpipe wall will fall
'plock plock' onto the small 'water pool' inside the pipe
elbow, causing the infamous marble dropping
sound.
(6) Many of the floor traps are fitted with mosquito
trap mechanism. This mechanism would be opened by running
water, and closed when the water has ceased running. Thus a
constant flow of water will caus ethe mechanism to open and
shut continuously, and the sounds emitted will sounds very
identical to the marble dropping sounds.
(7) The sounds may not be marble dropping sounds at all.
Our high-rise apartments have many equipments like water
tanks, lifts, motor rooms, switch rooms etc. Condominiums
would have even more facilities like swimming pools, tennis
courts, artificial waterfalls etc. All these basically means
there are alot more equipment & embedded wall piping
running in our walls & ceiling. These also means alot more
chance for vibrations caused by running engines, motors,
turbines etc. All these vibration causing equipment has the
potential of creating rattling sounds in walls and ceilings
when they are start up. These rattling sounds can sometimes
travel from 1 block to the next, or from the ground floor to
the top floor, becoming more 'echo-y' along the way, till it
manifest itself as 'marble dropping' sounds at the higher
floor. These kind of marble sounds usually sounds mechanical,
last for a period of time, and is constant during the period
the sound is heard.
Article written by Charles Goh
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